• 訪客:Finally      2019/11/17 9:21:57    

    Finally someone is considering possible solutions instead of more polarisation.. I'm not calling it a solution, but it's time for consideration of opposing views, not condemnation.

    回覆(2019/11/17 9:21:57)

  • 訪客:Mr. Tsang is quite logic. Hmmm      2019/11/17 9:03:55    

    HKFP REPORTS HONG KONG INTERVIEWS POLITICS & PROTEST Interview: Ex-head of legislature Jasper Tsang says the gov’t is weakest player of four in Hong Kong’s struggle 16 November 2019 11:00 Guest Contributor15 min read Donate HKFP Exclusive banner ribbon Jasper Tsang is a veteran politician of the pro-Beijing camp who managed to impress both sides as a notably impartial president of the legislature between 2008 to 2016. In a wide-ranging interview last month, he shared with French academic Jean-Philippe Beja his thoughts on the continuing crisis in Hong Kong, why he supported the extradition bill and why the political paralysis persists. Jasper Tsang Jasper Tsang. Photo: LegCo. Jean-Philippe Béja: Since the beginning of June, a huge movement – perhaps the largest in the history of Hong Kong – has rocked the city. What are the factors which, according to you, explain it? Tsang Yok-sing: I guess it is the largest movement in the history of Hong Kong. Everyone, including our friends the pan-dems, were taken by surprise. Such an enormous scale! Now that we are four months into it, with the benefit of hindsight, we shouldn’t consider it was surprising at all. Many of us should have known that Hong Kong people had been unhappy, angry with both the Hong Kong government and the central government. Unhappy for two reasons: First, we were promised in the Basic Law that we would have full democracy. And in 2007, the Central government told us we could elect the Chief Executive by universal suffrage in 2017. We tried to do it, but in 2014 we failed to reach an agreement. The result is that not only did we lose the chance to elect the CE in 2017, but we also lost the timetable. Now we don’t know when – the timetable is gone. So many young people feel that there is no hope for them to see democracy in Hong Kong. This is one reason for their anger. pan democrats political reform Pan-democrats campaigned against the government’s political reform package in 2015. File Photo: Civic Party, via Facebook. The second reason lies in our social inequalities. Our economy has grown reasonably well in the last 20 or 30 years, but ordinary people don’t feel that they can share the fruit of our growth. Young people see social inequality getting worse; the wealth gap is widening and our problems are the most striking in housing. When I started working 50 years ago, when I finished university, after a few years I could buy an apartment and then sell it to buy a bigger one. So I was able to improve my living conditions. Now it is different for the middle class. I recently talked to an accountant. She said ‘I’m OK, I own my home, but I cannot improve. And then when my children leave university they won’t be able to buy a home.’ Now, if you say young people are rebelling because they can’t buy a home, it is not fair. Because they see that no one can buy a home. The fruits of economic growth have gone to big developers. lion rock File photo: Wikimedia Commons. But these two problems are linked. The Chief Executive is selected by an election committee, not by the people, and the election committee is dominated by big business. So in the eyes of the people, and especially the young, the government always stands on the side of big business, never on the side of the poor. Another thing. This resentment very easily turns into anger towards China. We don’t have democracy because Beijing doesn’t allow it, and life is so hard for Hongkongers, because of people coming from the north, the rich ones, come to buy our property so our prices are so high. They take away our resources; every day, 150 people from the mainland settle in Hong Kong, 50,000 people coming from poorer places in China who take our public housing, schools etc. This is not really true. The government has often explained – and the NGOs that help these new immigrants have explained – that these immigrants provide the labour we need so badly, contributing to the economy. But public opinion is negative. immigration tower wanchai Immigration Tower. File photo: HKFP/Ellie Ng. That is why the extradition Bill sparked so much anger. All of a sudden, people in Hong Kong have thought that the government was taking away the firewall between Hong Kong and the mainland. I have defended the bill because I thought it is ridiculous that, for historical reasons, not a single fugitive has been sent back to China in 22 years. Though China has sent back Hong Kong criminals when the government demanded it. Béja: But people don’t trust the government, especially after the kidnapping of booksellers and tycoon Xiao Jianhua… Tsang: This is true. But in both cases, the booksellers and Four Seasons tycoon were not sent to China legally because we lack the legal framework. For 22 years, the Hong Kong government has been negotiating with the Central government without success, because Beijing didn’t want to accept the conditions required by the Hong Kong side. Chan Tong-kai Taiwan murder suspect released prison "October 23" Chan Tong-kai, the murder suspect whose case sparked a political crisis in Hong Kong. Photo: Stand News. And, all of a sudden, thanks to the effort of the Chief Executive, Beijing accepted… the Fugitive Offenders Ordinance passed before 1997, which was drafted in consistence with international criteria, [for extradition] on a case-by-case basis. The Hong Kong government regarded it as a major breakthrough. Beijing had accepted our conditions. The booksellers couldn’t be sent to China. I was telling people, the government doesn’t ask you to believe in the judicial system in China. For example, we don’t believe in the judicial system in the Philippines. However, there are extraditions as there is an agreement. Because, if there weren’t, it would be very easy for criminals in the Philippines to flee to Hong Kong and vice-versa. Now it is easy for criminals from China to come to Hong Kong, and there is nothing we can do. This is bad for the people of Hong Kong. That’s why I supported the bill. But then people said: we don’t only not believe in the judicial system in China, we don’t believe in the Hong Kong government either. If the Philippines government asks for someone to be extradited there, the government can refuse. But if Beijing requires it, the Hong Kong government can’t refuse. court china A court in China. File Photo: Xinhua. This is a problem. I told many diplomats in Hong Kong. You don’t have to fear that your nationals will be sent to China; it is not possible. They replied: in China, anything can happen. So this is the problem. And that is why this article triggered the crisis. Once it started, people found that it was their way to vent their feelings Béja: The anger that had been accumulated in the last five years, with the kidnappings, the invalidation of elected LegCo representatives… Tsang: You’re right. In the last five years, the Hong Kong government and many of my colleagues in the pro-government camp thought that we were winning victory after victory; but every time, people became angrier. Béja: Why did the CE suspend the bill and not withdraw it? Tsang: Carrie Lam was very proud of her accomplishment, and she perhaps had not expected the strong opposition from the pan-dems, who were determined not to let it go through LegCo. September 5 Carrie Lam Chief Executive Carrie Lam. Photo: Tom Grundy/HKFP. This made the Central government angry. It didn’t think the bill was so important, but then it became a matter of governance. Beijing said that if the government was tabling a bill, it had to pass it, and it was giving it all the necessary support. So after the demonstrations of June 9 and 12, when the CE was convinced that it was impossible to get the bill through Legco, she reported to Beijing. But, as she and Beijing were still convinced that there was nothing wrong with it, that they had only underestimated the opposition by the people, the central government told her to suspend it and make more consultations to submit it later. When Carrie Lam announced the suspension, she still said that it had been the right thing to do, that the purpose of the bill was to suppress loopholes in our law that had to be suppressed. But the people didn’t accept that, and the protesters put up their five demands. And it became a kind of political confrontation. At the same time, my colleagues in the pro-government camp were angry with the government, because they had defended the bill, explaining why it was necessary, when all of a sudden the Chief Executive suspended it. protest china extradition Sunday, June 16. Photo: Kris Cheng/HKFP. I guess she thought that if she withdrew the bill, it would be unacceptable to her supporters and to Beijing. This became more and more irrational. Carrie said that a suspension was equivalent to a withdrawal. the protesters were saying: “Say the word!”, while our side said: “Don’t say it!” Finally, when she said it, the other side said: “we’re not satisfied with that.” Same thing with the other demands: a commission of inquiry. She doesn’t want to do it because of objection from the police. But my colleagues said: “You said ‘no’, there is no need for such an inquiry; the IPCC is enough. Don’t betray us again!” But we don’t know, maybe in a week or two, it will be set up… It seems the government is unwilling to do anything until it is too late. Béja: You are a respected politician. You have a say. Why don’t you say that you are in favour of such a commission? Tsang: Not only me. A few weeks ago, after [Lam] announced the withdrawal, she mentioned four things she was going to do including the dialogue. She said she would organise meetings and – for a start – invited twenty people. I was among them and we had a meeting at Government House – almost everyone said that, if she wanted to start a dialogue, she should have to do something, and that the independent Commission was the thing to do. And I believe she has been hearing the same thing almost every day from various advisers. But she says it’s impossible. That day, she told us she couldn’t do it because of the opposition from the police. It is not that the police doesn’t allow her to do it. Carrie Lam explained that the morale of the police is quite fragile, and that the government can’t do anything that would harm [their] morale. Perhaps she told Beijing that it was necessary to boost the police’s morale, and therefore the Central government came in support of the police. hunger strike government house Hunger strikers and their supporters wait outside Government House for a meeting with Carrie Lam in July. Photo: inmediahk.net. Béja: In France, we often blame the police for what happens. But if a government doesn’t negotiate with protesters but only relies on the police, this means that violence escalates. Besides, the refusal to give letters of no objection to most demands for demonstration has been viewed by most people as an unbearable limitation of their freedoms. Now, protesters hate the police. Tsang: You are right. At a very early stage, two weeks after the start of the movement, hate of the police became the most important motivation for people to join the protests. And violence has been escalating again after the mask law. kwun tong china extradition august 24 Photo: May James/HKFP. The problem is that Carrie has met all sorts of people, including young people involved in the violence. She has listened to all sorts of advice. Some people say you can’t rely on the police, you have to reach out. She organised the first dialogue, but violence didn’t stop. So hardliners said that she had given rioters an opportunity to vilify the government, and that therefore she shouldn’t engage in dialogue any more… Another problem is: you can go on talking to the people, but what can you do? Of the five demands, the one demanding the release of all those who have been arrested can’t be met; even the pan-dems know it. Even if she agrees to negotiate on real universal suffrage, it will still be very difficult to come to an agreement. It can’t be done at once and satisfy everybody. The only demand that could be met is the commission of inquiry. Béja: If you declare publicly that it is necessary to set it up, it might help. October 16 LegCo policy address protest “Five demands, not one less.” Photo: Inmediahk.net. Tsang: Judge Andrew Li said it. Béja: But nobody from the DAB has. Tsang: Good point. However, the DAB won’t go public with anything they know the government can’t do. In private, they have been urging Carrie to establish it. But as long as she refuses, they won’t say anything. Béja: What‘s the exit strategy? Tsang: I’ve approached a number of people whom I know are in close contact with frontline policemen, from the rank and file. I’ve heard that some among the rank and file don’t object to an independent commission, as they see it is as a way to clear their reputation. I asked them if they could take a public stance, but they all have replied that the police would never accept it. Xi Jinping File photo: Xi Jinping. Béja: Isn’t Beijing opposed to that commission? Which leads to more violence? Tsang: It is dangerous for Hong Kong. I don’t know what the people in Beijing want. Up to now, they have no intention to interfere. Now, I see four players: The protesters: they don’t have any intention to stop. The people: a large part of our population is supporting them. The SAR government: it is incapable of doing anything, Carrie Lam has admitted it. The government is made up of very competent administrators but there are no politicians. Beijing: they have no intention to interfere. If all this doesn’t change, we cannot expect it to end. The Central and the SAR governments want to appeal to the public to denounce the radicals. But is not working. My hope lies in the protesters; it seems that, recently, some of them have called to stop the violence. And there is a very good reason for that. Elections are coming and it is very probable, as public sentiment is very much against the government, that if they take place in November, the pro-government camp will lose. 2019 District Council election briefing session 2019 District Council election briefing session. Photo: Citizen News. These protesters say: if you go on with more violence, you may alienate more people and give an excuse to the government to postpone the election. But we don’t know how much the most radical protesters will listen. Béja: If the situation is such, will the DAB be hostile to elections? Tsang: Some of us have thought of that, but it is not the mainstream thinking, because we know it would create a backlash. If the elections are postponed by two weeks, which is allowed by the law, it won’t change anything. To postpone it for a longer time, you need a new law. If the government invokes the Emergency Regulations Ordinance it will have a negative effect in Hong Kong and in the international community. And the Legco elections will come next year; voters could make us pay for that delay. So the majority of the DAB leadership says that we will have to face it; elections will come, and it is the government’s responsibility to prevent disruption. september 29 china extradition protest admiralty File photo: May James/HKFP Béja: During the protests, there have been thousands of arrests. The protesters say they cannot abandon their comrades-in-arms. Tsang: You’re right. I made a proposal: the government should offer amnesty with two lines drawn: You can’t pardon very serious crimes, serious bodily harm. But many of the people who have been arrested didn’t commit serious crimes. A line on time. The government should say: the CE is going to grant an amnesty, but you have to stop the violence. Those who continue to engage in violence after a certain date will be punished. We have put this to the government. But, once more, there are others who tell Carrie an amnesty is out of the question. Some people say that even young boys should bear criminal responsibility, that any talk of pardon will breed more violence, which I don’t agree [with]. However, our biggest problem is that the weakest of the four players is our government. There is no strong decision-making mechanism. The CE listens to the hardliners, and there is no politician who could take responsibility. Jasper Tsang Jasper Tsang. Photo: LegCo. Béja: Why don’t you? You can relate to people in both camps. Tsang: It is difficult even for me to maintain dialogue. Even if I could, there is little I can do. Béja: If moderates in both camps got together, there might be a solution. If there are no discussions with the government, no progress, more and more people could despair, and turn towards independence. Tsang: I wish more people in the government thought like that. Tell it to C.Y. Leung. Jean-Philippe Béja is a Senior Research Fellow at the National Centre for Scientific Research and the Centre for International Studies and Research at Sciences-Po, in Paris. An observer for decades of relations between society and the Party in China, he has written extensively on intellectuals and on the pro-democracy movement in the PRC, and on Hong Kong politics. Hong Kong Free Press relies on direct reader support. Help safeguard independent journalism and press freedom as we invest more in freelancers, overtime, safety gear & insurance during this summer’s protests. 10 ways to support us. fundraising fundraise banner China Extradition Jasper Tsang Taiwan election In Taiwan elections, mudslinging and shock-and-awe tactics should be seen as a sign of desperation PLA Baptist University Kowloon Tong Chinese army help clear protest debris at Hong Kong Baptist University YOU MAY ALSO LIKE Commercial radio Hong Kong police journalist reporter Mong Kok protest sponge grenade HONG KONG LAW & CRIME POLITICS & PROTEST Hong Kong journalism groups condemn alleged police firing of projectile at reporter as officer put on leave 16 November 2019 23:00 John Burns government house LAW & CRIME OPINION POLITICS & PROTEST Hong Kong’s honours system needs reform – too often the gov’t gives awards to itself 16 November 2019 21:00 Kent Ewing protest Hong Kong OPINION POLITICS & PROTEST A dialogue and reconciliation forum ‘to heal Hong Kong’ is hard to take seriously 16 November 2019 09:00 gui minhai HONG KONG LAW & CRIME POLITICS & PROTEST Sweden honours detained Gui Minhai despite Chinese threats 16 November 2019 08:32 HONG KONG POLITICS & PROTEST Hong Kong’s white-collar workers join the ranks of protesters 16 November 2019 08:00 Rocky Tuan COMMUNITY & EDUCATION HONG KONG POLITICS & PROTEST Chinese University of Hong Kong may seek gov’t assistance if protester occupation continues, says head 15 November 2019 18:50 Teresa Cheng metropolitan police London HONG KONG LAW & CRIME POLITICS & PROTEST UK police to investigate assault after Hong Kong Justice Sec. 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Hong Kong Free Press is a non-profit English language news source seeking to unite critical voices. Free and independent, HKFP launched in 2015 amid rising concerns over declining press freedom in Hong Kong and during an important time in the city’s constitutional development. Click here to learn how you can support us and ensure our independence. Search the archives by date November 2019 M T W T F S S « OCT 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 ABOUT HONG KONG FREE PRESSADVERTISE WITH HONG KONG FREE PRESSANNUAL REPORT 2018ANNUAL REPORT 2017ANNUAL REPORT 2016COMMUNITY GUIDELINESCONTACT HONG KONG FREE PRESSHKFP DIM SUM: WEEKLY EMAIL DIGESTHKFP REPORTING CITATIONSHKFP IN THE NEWSJOBS AT HKFPTRANSPARENCY REPORT 2017TRANSPARENCY REPORT 2016PRIVACY, T’S & C’SSUPPORT HONG KONG FREE PRESSTHANK YOUWRITE FOR HKFP ABOUT HKFPSUPPORT HKFPCONTACTNEWSLETTERADVERTISEWRITE FOR HKFP © 2016 Hong Kong Free Press Limited. Design: Tom Grundy, disuye & SZS.

    回覆(2019/11/17 11:40:46)

    如此長文,你估有冇人有心機耐性睇?no matter how good your intention is, 你在趕客。

  • 訪客:千呼萬喚始來出出來      2019/11/16 17:14:01    

    等了超過五個月解放軍人員今天終於出來止暴制亂了。 證明堵路有效。

    回覆(2019/11/16 17:14:01)

  • 訪客:another midnight      2019/11/16 0:34:32    

    as hk is in cultural revolution situation. the blue ribbons. the black society thugs. the underground ccp agents. the Govt. the establishment camp. all coordinating together. the ordinary ignorant ill-informed confused naive folks continue their mundane normal living. some unfortunates have fallen into Death traps though. some get arrested in absurd circumstances, merely struck by bad luck. (she is going out to buy a meal, bumping into police in the street, then gets arrested, then....)

    回覆(2019/11/16 0:34:32)

  • 訪客:號外      2019/11/15 8:24:25    

    有人發出呼籲: 不論大家政見如何,請關心一班獨居長者,有社福機構表示昨天已經不能送飯到這些長者家中,他們有些是不能自己進食的,需要義工協助,但因各區堵路,義工已無法到達。昨天已有長者全天收不到飯餸,現在如何也未知。 請廣傳這個呼籲,叫各位市民多關心鄰居,特別是附近有獨居長者,或需要醫療協助的人士,請敲敲門,給予他們所需的協助。

    回覆(2019/11/17 22:43:11)

    唉!又係有事鍾無艷。平時又唔見你地咁關心D獨居長者。

  • 訪客:oo      2019/11/15 6:02:25    

    a cultural revolution style group appeared in yuen long yesterday. let it be, hk cultural revolution 2.0, echoes from 1960s again. there are not many Real intelligentsia in hk society actually. look at certain university principals, they are already part of the establishment camp. the protesting students are the main targets of the Party. many have been arrested. has any university scholar been arrested so far in 2019 movement? (benny Tai, chan kin man from 2014 umbrella) ho sik ying actually caused some protestor arrests?

    回覆(2019/11/15 6:02:25)

  • 訪客:My coach      2019/11/14 17:46:10    

    I’m ashamed to say I’ve been avoiding/forgetting about the news in Hong Kong. Today we found out the skating competition there this week has been cancelled and I know that’s kind of a pathetic reason to watch the news again but after seeing the endless videos I am almost crying. This one in particular showed me the ruins of places I use to walk through every day as an exchange student in HK during the peaceful 2014 protests. It’s a horrible truth that the lack of outcome from the non-violent Umbrella Movement has led to HKers believing that in their fight against a behemoth violence is the only answer. I don’t know if that’s true or not, but I’m wondering what the use is of violence and destruction against public transport and places that the local Hong Kongers themselves use and benefit from. Why destroy a defunct train carriage? Why not channel that warranted anger in more beneficial ways? I’m not there and I don’t pretend to understand all the emotion and history fuelling this war, but I stand with your goals, if not all the methods. #standwithhk 🇭🇰

    回覆(2019/11/14 17:46:10)

  • 訪客:嘩!! 好勁      2019/11/13 19:58:07    

    【暴亂中的城大憲法課:We are a class of law. 我們不會向暴力屈服!】 一名香港城市大學的學生日前在社交媒體發文,記錄了在暴徒發起「三罷」、全港八校停課之際,建制派議員、城大法學院梁美芬副教授堅持上了一節憲法課。 11日,一大早交通全面擁堵,到處都是路障,多地被人放火。很多人歷經艱難險阻到了學校,學校卻一直警鈴大作。可能是暴徒為了擾亂課堂,用打火機去熏各個煙霧報警器,導致火警鈴聲停不下來。 同學擔心梁教授可能不能來上課時,她一如既往地按時出現了。同學們等了很久,警鈴都沒有停下來。梁教授遺憾地說,這節課要不然取消吧?同學開始收拾東西時也表達了遺憾,因為抵校艱難,卻終究還是空跑一趟。 這時梁教授說,那如果我們照常上課呢?你們覺得可以嗎?同學們大聲回答:「可以! 」於是,在不絕於耳的警鈴聲中,在保安把守教室的情況下,梁教授用麥克風上完了這節課。她說,We are a class of law. 我們堅持上這節課,就是要證明,我們不會向暴力屈服! 雖然上完課出來時,熟悉的校園已到處一片狼藉。但同學表示,這將成為我永生難忘的一節憲法課。有人縱火「救港」,我們讀書報國!

    回覆(2019/11/13 19:58:07)

  • 訪客:Thank you!      2019/11/13 19:52:43    

    各位車友,如果係醫院門囗附近,巴士站見到啲老人家等車,嘗試問問佢哋去邊,睇睇洗唔洗幫幫佢哋!謝謝!

    回覆(2019/11/13 19:52:43)

  • 訪客:Eliza      2019/11/13 18:40:05    

    What do you do when you hear that your close friend got stuck in the traffic and did not arrive home until 4 am in the morning? Well, I have to show my empathy because of the fact that she suffered inadequate sleep. Other than that, I can not say anything because I have lost my freedom of speech.What do you do when you hear that your close friend got stuck in the traffic and did not arrive home until 4 am in the morning? Well, I have to show my empathy because of the fact that she suffered inadequate sleep. Other than that, I can not say anything because I have lost my freedom of speech.

    回覆(2019/11/13 18:40:05)

  • 訪客:市民為了返工可以去到幾盡! 唔知以為去了印度      2019/11/13 17:01:44    

    oh my goodness 大家有無係FB 睇呢條片,十幾廿人迫埋一齊又坐又企又扶喺架泥頭車,雖然我有小小 fancy 想搭埋一份,但係真有D險象環生.. 點呢? :)

    回覆(2019/11/13 17:01:44)

  • 訪客:我已經收到10,000個 WhatsApp messages..      2019/11/13 15:17:56    

    一個公司,一個教會,我想熄電話,遠離人群,遠離 internet... 讓微微的清風吹走我的不安 please

    回覆(2019/11/13 15:17:56)

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